Archbishop Isaac Nwaobia, Leader of Southern Nigeria Bishops Conference (Anglican Communion), wants Nigerians to join hands with the government in reclaiming the country from bandits.

He Is also calling on the authorities for the release of the jailed leader of the Indigenous Peoples of Biafra (IPOB), Nnamdi Kanu from prison to reduce tension in the South East.

In this interview with Sunday Sun, he posits, among others, that religious leaders should have a work plan that protects their membership instead of fanning bigotry and ethnicity.

The killings and abduction of innocent citizens in the country seem not to be abating, though government is saying otherwise. What do you say to this?

First, we want to continue thanking God Almighty because if not for his mercies, this country would have disintegrated, gone into pieces. The situation we find ourselves in presently is very pitiable and condemnable for the fact that God has bestowed on us, abundant responsible intellectuals, skills but like I say all the time, these things are wrongly channelled and managed. People speak less about the nation. Until our leaders and the led think Nigeria, think about our country, we will not be able to pass the stage we are in today. The ugly experience is coming now because people are thinking less about the nation and more about themselves, their tribe and ethnicity. We’ve seen people in developed countries see their nation as number one. For example, Americans think America first, with other things then following.

The issue of insecurity, from the way it is being handled in our country, has shown that it is man- made. It is man-made in the context that if one is asked to lead our security agencies and supplied all that is needed, he will withstand the problem. If our leaders have been sincere, acknowledging the dangers on ground, we would have overcome the issue. Even the Bible we read in Galatians 6.7, told us that “God is not mocked, whatever a man sows he will reap.” Our leadership should think ahead and be proactive to protect this country and its people in the next 50 years, 40 years, 30 years and begin to package the system to work with. Let them start with civic education, re-orientation of our mental nature and commitment of our leaders. If we do like this, the issue will be minimised and taken care of. If we go on with contending with insurgency only without civic education and responsibilities at the grassroots community levels, at the foundation, it will still surface somewhere along the way. If we encourage the led without commitment and passion from the leadership, insurgency will continue to be a threat.

People have spoken variously on the United States of America (USA) government’s assistance to help stop the carnage, with some saying that there were no targeted killings and abduction of people of particular faith in Nigeria by bandits?

Those arguing the non-existent killing of Christians in Nigeria, stand on the same process of deceit. They have agreed that there are killings but we then ask, which groups are being targeted? If we talk of ratio, it is nine Christian killings to one Muslim abduction out of ten cases. I don’t feel that any mosque had been deliberately destroyed or burnt as much as churches. Our Christian brothers in the north are saying that on invasion of communities, the bandits take over their entire land, destroy legacy infrastructure and occupy with their families, while the original owners are left to stay perpetually in internally displaced persons (IDP) camps with the government not allowing them to return. The bandits, they said, come with their families to take possession of such land, thereby pushing the original owners away forever. They will be advised not to go back to the land even without being compensated for what they have invested over several years. One will then ask if this is not a targeted attack on Christians and their investments in their ancestral homes. So, those fronting for those in authority cannot say this is not targeted at Christians. One will see that after the move by the American president, Trump, there have been increased attacks on churches, mission schools and Christian communities with abduction of innocent individuals. This still goes on to confirm that there’s killing of Christians in Nigeria.

Can’t the church, through its organs, CAN and PFN, do something to forestall the attacks just like herders who are seen openly carrying weapons purporting to protect themselves against cattle rustlers?

To me, the church is not doing enough. What we see of church leadership today is looking after their cathedrals, gospel bands, buying exotic cars and latest models of jeeps, private jets, building universities and denominational segregations. These are the things that have pulled the church away from its actual responsibility of looking after and herding Christ’s sheep to pasture. The church left its responsibility to God and the Nigerian people. We now think about our denominations more than having collective efforts, and thinking about nation building. If you go to our seminary schools, are they what they are supposed to be, which is the training ground for Christian leadership? As times and events are changing, should we not add basic moral training for our pastors, give them needed exposure to emerging daily security occurrences in our land? I want to say that the church has not and is not doing enough for Christians and the sustenance of peace and unity in Nigeria, in view of present day situations we find ourselves. The church leaders should have a work plan. Let there be an action plan on what we will collectively do to speed up and contain the current escalation of insecurity in which people of the Christian faith are targeted. The issue of terrorism acts against churches, their members and mission schools on our country is real. Our pastors and youths are littered all over the country without passing through any training in the Boys Brigade (BB), or Boys Scouts movements, where Christian youths are moulded and disciplined into becoming useful adult citizens with high moral standards to lead peaceful society lives. Should we not give the youths basic life’s training instead of just carrying the Bible? Most of our youths today, do not know how to carry catapult to defend themselves. Rather, they join crude ways of engaging in drug uses to be able to withstand pressure and challenges. They have resorted to criminal activities in their communities. There must be action plans to put the youths into positive engagements for societal growth and enduring peace. Our major threat is that many of our pastors did not have the training so it is difficult to ask them to impart knowledge that they do not have to the younger generation.

Can’t this issue be introduced and discussed for implementation during CAN meetings?

It can but like I said earlier, one cannot give what he or she doesn’t have. If the CAN leadership has the skill, it would have been proactive in its policy programmes and actions and consulting those with ideas on how to tame the tide and get things right at this critical period. Like if someone is sick, he ought to consult with a medical doctor but if one feels that he is a pastor and has all it takes to command both physical and spiritual challenges, then such person will surely be fumbling and far from being truthful.

Some new generation Pentecostal pastors teach their members against seeking professional medical attention during physical health challenges, claiming the Holy Spirit will heal such people. What do you make of such?

What you are talking about is a long abstract theology. Even the Bible asked us to pray and work. If one only prays and refuses to work, prayer only cannot give him food. It is money realised from work that can guarantee physical food to keep him in good health and give him strength to live for another minute, hour and day. God created the various professions and put men and women who study to become experts and professionals to help provide healing for the physical body ailments. It is from one’s skill and job in a paid engagement that money will come for feeding and cure of physical health challenges. It is not theology for us to transfer every physical challenge to the Holy spirit. Using the Holy Spirit, blood of Jesus, is not panacea towards solving daily physical problems that Almighty God had put into our hands to solve. We need to work so that God will bless our hand work to excel.

Government has always absolved herders from heinous crimes, stressing that the guns they carry are to wade off cattle rustlers. Now you are advocating training for Christians to be able to retaliate when attacked. Don’t you think that would result into chaos?

The government Is not being sincere at all. Even during our youthful days in my village primary school, we used to see useful Fulani cattle rearers with sticks herding their cows. Some of them even slept on open school football fields with their cows at night without destroying people’s farmland and unharmed by the villagers. Today, the story is extremely different. One sees cattle rearers carrying AK-47 rifles with chains of life ammunition and leading cows into farms with crops, where they munch the leaves, destroy the planted crops while the owners who try to protest, are either beaten with their shepherd staff or even shot dead on allegations of trying to harm their cows. Many females farmers have been variously intimidated, abducted and raped and the government and its agents are saying otherwise. In the past, herders were welcomed in rural villages because they and their cows didn’t harm people or destroyed farmland. They were not entering the farms but it is like a premeditated warrant today. They see the planted, unharvested farms and still lead their cows into them and then beat, maul and annihilate those that try to complain. One somewhere is now telling us that they only retaliate on provocation. This is totally wrong and false. The new development started around the year 2000 and is a new concept, possibly with an agenda to sack the natives and take over their land. It is an abomination before God and the Christian faith. It is anti human, against humanity and should be condemned in its entirety.

How do you want the current government to respond to all these to stem the tide and return Nigeria to peaceful coexistence and unity?

Government should face reality by condemning the actions of the bandits terrorising the country and abducting the citizens. Their sponsors should be identified publicly and made to face the law to avert looming crises that may consume us all. The citizens should be prepared to assist the government in checking the activities of those criminals. We should not keep quiet and keep crying only. If we continue to cry daily, today, tomorrow and the next, nothing will be done. It will have no effect because the wicked will not rest on his oars. Brothers and sisters, we need to respond. Let there be thinking outside the government box. Bring out a solution on what we ought to do to contain the tide.

Who will constitute the think tank in view of the current clamp down on those that move to act outside government programmes on issues of putting things right in Nigeria?

I understand but I tell you that it won’t continue like this for too long, all the time. Civil society groups should rise up to their responsibility. If one wants to serve the nation, he or she is bound to face challenges. Here, I am not saying that all present day government functionaries are totally bad – Governors, Senators, House of Representatives members. When you watch their sessions in the Assembly, there are concerns. Many of them are really bitter on the way things are going on in the country. Look at the issue of withdrawal of their security details late last year by the police high command. They are panicking. So, there is really a problem in the country that requires urgent response and handling. Our civil society organisations should join hands with well meaning Nigerians who do not want the country to disintegrate further, to act decisively to arrest the situation.

You have advocated the release of IPOB Leader, Nnamdi Kanu, jailed for treason by the federal government, to help scale down the issues leading to insecurity in the South East? What is your reaction to his continued incarceration?

All that I can say is that all that transpired in and out of the court during the long process of his trial were woven on hatred, on a man that proposed to marry a bride, with parents and relations of the would-be wife refusing to accept him to become their son inlaw. This is what has influenced Kanu’s every action in the entire case. He went through challenges within and without. Here, I am not accusing all our South East governors of allowing the matter to degenerate to the level it reached without doing anything to salvage the situation before now. The issue of his kidnapping and extradition from Kenya showed us in the face. He saw the way, the hatred on the Igbo race to which he belongs to was going. His rendition to Nigeria was enough for the international community to condemn, come in to ask that he be taken back to Kenya and full application for his repatriation made to the Kenyan government. He went to court in Kenya and here in Nigeria and obtained judgements. He defeated the government, then those in authority decided to follow it their own way. This is injustice at play. I recall what I said sometime ago about our election tribunals and equate it with the Nnamdi Kanu’s issue. I posited that when the system is good and people get thoroughly defeated, they ought not seek loopholes to hinge on to so that the tribunal might upturn their losses. It is only those that do mago mago, that is, engage in fraudulent acts or cheat, that seek loopholes in technicalities to change clear results. Otherwise, our courts would have been a citadel where prudent judgements are delivered by God-fearing jurists. Let people lead transparent lives. The judiciary should see the truth, say the truth and stand by it. If a good judge is forgotten today, tomorrow he will get remembered. If we are remembering the likes of Late Justice Kayode Esho, late Justice Chukwudifu Oputa, and Justice Muhammed Uwais, even after their demise, those that did proud to Nigeria’s justice system will always be honoured even in the hereafter. It is not what one takes home from here and there which will consume him, rather the legacy he or she leaves behind. Now that the verdict had been given, I want to ask that the issue of pardon should be extended to him. This is not a death sentence. All over the world, even those on death sentence get parole and are pardoned. So, we believe that his will not be an exception.

Kanu’s pardon will go a long way in reducing tension in the South East and reassuring Ndigbo that we are part and parcel of the entity called Nigeria. The earlier this is done, the better for us all. (The Sun)

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